Minimal Wave Records

dude, give me a break.  i’ve been reading this thread for a while, and getting a little frustrated with the constant back and forth on this matter, getting further and further from the root of this matter.  to say that no one values the band or the music is just ridiculous.  if you weren’t being so shady about your motives and sold the LP through standard channels, for a fixed price that is both fair to you as a label and to the consumer as a buyer, then i’m sure we’d all be interested in owning a copy.

instead, you fire off excuses as to why you’re charging a high price off the gate, and then expecting people to pay more and more as the price continues.  it’s not going to happen, no matter how many single digit buyers you get per week by tagging the auctions with “minimal synth.”

there are a bunch of reissue labels out there currently- all selling reissue LPs for a modest price directly, with no bidding inflation or any of that bullshit.  similar music, similar demand, and they generally sell out or do rather well in the end.  do the math, man.

look likes this guy is not living for the music but only for the money, a shame..

frankieteardrop said:

to say that no one values the band or the music is just ridiculous.

Why is it ridiculous?  I just gave everyone a chance to show how much they
care about the band by spending money that would go directly to the band,
and not one person that says that they care about the band did that.

if you weren’t being so shady about your motives and sold the LP

How am I being shady? There is absolutely nothing about this release that is shady.
It is a legitimate original issue released with a signed contract between the band and the label, and sold on ebay exclusively.  There is nothing shady about any of that.

And what would the shady motive be?  To lose $11,000 from my own bank account?

If you have read this thread you should have been able to understand everything I have said
because I have been vehemently clear in regards to all the questions people have asked about the release, and my intentions with the release.  Here is a summary.

Obscure identities is going to release collectable records that are made for collectors specifically, and are true to the band, and the era in which they were recorded. 

and sold the LP through standard channels, for a fixed price that is both fair to you as a label and to the consumer as a buyer, then i’m sure we’d all be interested in owning a copy.

Basically the people that are interested in owning a copy will buy a copy.

And anyone that wants this record, and cannot come up with $40 in one and a half years should not be buying records period.

I think anyone that comes on this thread and argues about the price and the method of sales of this record is completely acting selfishly out of their own interest, and could care less about the band. 

instead, you fire off excuses as to why you’re charging a high price off the gate, and then expecting people to pay more and more as the price continues.

I have fired off no excuses.  I have stated everything about this record, and my label as clear as possible. 

$39.99 is not a high price for this record.  If this record came out in 1980 right now it would a $300 to $500 record as I have said before.  To pay roughly a tenth of that price is nothing if you like this band.

there are a bunch of reissue labels out there currently- all selling reissue LPs for a modest price directly, with no bidding inflation or any of that bullshit. similar music, similar demand, and they generally sell out or do rather well in the end. do the math, man.

O.K., here is the math. 

500 press minimal synth record + around 100 minimal synth collectors = 100 minimal synth collectors buying $20 records that won’t sell for $0.99 on ebay in the future + 400 copies that were distributed to stores of which most will sit in those stores unpurchased.

80 press record sold to 100 minimal synth collectors directly = A collectable record to begin with, that will go up in value.

Frankie, I am a not going to put out worthless 500 press minimal synth records so
that people that don’t care about the music or the band enough to spend $40 can enjoy the records. 

That is exactly what I am not about doing.

Marsman said:

look likes this guy is not living for the music but only for the money, a shame..

and it looks like Marsman didn’t read any of this thread with a statement like that right after I said I am spending tons of money out of my own pocket to release great records that are collectable for most likely no profit.

I want to see love as a percentage of regional gdp.

[quote author=“obscure”]

O.K., here is the math. 

500 press minimal synth record + around 100 minimal synth collectors = 100 minimal synth collectors buying $20 records that won’t sell for $0.99 on ebay in the future + 400 copies that were distributed to stores of which most will sit in those stores unpurchased.

80 press record sold to 100 minimal synth collectors directly = A collectable record to begin with, that will go up in value.

Frankie, I am a not going to put out worthless 500 press minimal synth records so
that people that don’t care about the music or the band enough to spend $40 can enjoy the records. 

That is exactly what I am not about doing.

Stephen,

why do you keep saying that the LP has a selling potential of a hundred copies when you keep arguing it isn’t true?

If 100 collectors had been the Grand Total, then the LP you put out in a hundred copies would never rise in value, because everyone who wanted it, already had it!

I’ve seen reissues that didn’t sell out in an edition of 500, but VOD have a lot more subscribers than that, Minimal Wave have several albums out in their second edition, Anna sold out the 500 Transparent Illusion vinyl in a few weeks. The potential for an LP of All The Madmen, known from their astonishing, instantly recognisable contribution to Cry Havoc (also bootlegged on Flexipop), is of course much higher - that is why you think the LP will rise in value; You predict that those who don’t buy it now will miss out.

I think if you had cleaned up the sound a little, printed a cover, gotten the LP out to the shops and mail orders, of course you’d sell more than a hundred copies. And as I suppose the start expenses were most of the pressing costs here, I think the LP would have been much cheaper to produce, and could have sold at a price comparable to other records out in 2010.

I have no objection to you releasing whatever record however you like. I think you’re a collector and tried to make a collector’s item, didn’t you?

What strikes me as the most peculiar detail in all of this is the fact that you pressed 100 copies, but are only selling 80 of them.

I can only imagine the real motivation behind holding 20% of the batch. I’m sure it’s as honest and true as you’d like us to believe. 

[quote author=“fastfashion”]What strikes me as the most peculiar detail in all of this is the fact that you pressed 100 copies, but are only selling 80 of them.

I can only imagine the real motivation behind holding 20% of the batch. I’m sure it’s as honest and true as you’d like us to believe. 

I am sure “young” Stephen is not the only label owner holding a few copies as a future investment.
In general collectors are also keen on investing for the future.

I followed this discussion a while now.
I do not agree on Stephen’s way of doing business but I think he’s only a minor example of how most label owners operate. Especially in this niche market.
Let’s face it: This is all collectors talk. Nothing to do with art. Nothing to do with the artists. I think although the musicians sometimes represent an alternative way of thinking, the label owners and the collectors of this music are representing the ultimate capitalist dream.

ouch! :(

[quote author=“Nogah”]I am sure “young” Stephen is not the only label owner holding a few copies as a future investment.

....

Let’s face it: This is all collectors talk. Nothing to do with art. Nothing to do with the artists. I think although the musicians sometimes represent an alternative way of thinking, the label owners and the collectors of this music are representing the ultimate capitalist dream.

Well if you cared to take a stroll and have a look at the other threads, now we do discuss music from time to time here as well. Although it doesn’t happen altogether too often I must admit. 8)

So holding back a couple of copies is the ultimate capitalist dream?

Firstly, what would your alternative way of thinking be? Free love and free LP copies for everybody, and the label owner gets the dosh to do it from the Easter Bunny?

Secondly, have you ever been accused of thinking too big? Lady Gaga is the ultimate capitalist dream, what we’ve got here is Pennystocks Central on a rather good day… :wink:

[quote author=“falck”] So holding back a couple of copies is the ultimate capitalist dream?

Are you trying to outsmart me Falck or are you to stupid to understand ? I am talking about the principle, not how big this profit is.
Strangely some of you have big problems with Stephen (thread of 8 pages) making a few pennies and when I call the same thing a capitalist dream all of a sudden it is of no importance ?
[quote author=“falck”] Firstly, what would your alternative way of thinking be? Free love and free LP copies for everybody, and the label owner gets the dosh to do it from the Easter Bunny?

I already stated that in my opinion music nowadays is best distributed by digital means. So: no waste of valuable matter, no colectable value, no copies to hold behind, better quality of sound. Lets face it: Most (if not all) of these vinyl or tape releases end up still sealed in collectors collections. To what purpose ? The rest of the world just downloads the digital rip. I say: Just go digital for a fair price. And don’t bore me with that talk about vinyl sounding better or the artwork on a sleeve please.

You must have been lurking on the forum for quite some time before joining us, Nogah? It’s uncanny how you’ve assimilated the tribe dialect within a week and four posts…

[quote author=“Nogah”][quote author=“falck”] So holding back a couple of copies is the ultimate capitalist dream?

Are you trying to outsmart me Falck or are you to stupid to understand ? I am talking about the principle, not how big this profit is.
Strangely some of you have big problems with Stephen (thread of 8 pages) making a few pennies and when I call the same thing a capitalist dream all of a sudden it is of no importance ?
[quote author=“falck”] Firstly, what would your alternative way of thinking be? Free love and free LP copies for everybody, and the label owner gets the dosh to do it from the Easter Bunny?

Nogah,

As I already mentioned earlier on, it is you who seems to have problems to understand this scene and it kinda looks like you have come to the wrong forum.

To stress the blatantly obvious, this is not the Wasn’t Woodstock Great Forum and very few people round here are old hippies.

Instead, most of the people who post here happen to love vinyl and if you think mp3s are great, fine, but do us a favour and spare us this waste of resources blabla. And if you must know, there are two sealed LPs in my entire collection which make up for approximately 0.1 percent of it.

Also, you misinterpret this thread re. Young Stephen trying to make money, that’s not the point, I am not aware that people object to label owners making a bit of money on principle. It is even a good thing if they do as chances are higher they will continue with their work and make further releases.

The particular problem with Young Stephen is that he is obsessed with having something of high value others desperately want and that he wants others to perceive him as superiour. And he is prepared to go to quite some length for that. Well, I guess being a highschool reject does that to some people.

To conclude, I couldn’t care less what the rest of the world does, I want to listen to music coming from my turntable. Lemmings are also a form of mass movement.  :wink:

O.K., here is the math… “Bear in mind the simple rule, X squared to the power of two minus five over the seven point eight three times nineteen is approximately equal to the cube root of MCC squared divided by X minus a quarter of a third percent. Kepp that in mind, and you can´t go very far wrong.” (Eric Idle)

[quote author=“falck”]As I already mentioned earlier on, it is you who seems to have problems to understand this scene and it kinda looks like you have come to the wrong forum.

Is this a “members only” forum ? I beg your pardon but I think there are more music lovers then vinyl lovers even to this explicit music genre. I think this site is an enthausiastic and excellent information source for music lovers. I have my doubts about the concept of the label associated with it though. I could have seen it coming that especially the forum section is a place for a small elite (well that’s how you -and possibly others- see it)
I try to discuss here Falck, you seem to want to exclude people from being here.

Well if you weren’t so new to the forum, reading this “elite” bit I’d say you sound a bit like Ton’s long lost twin brother.  8)

Now I think you were off to a bad start when you suggested that vinyl should be abolished as a true music lover does not need it by definition.

Of course this is true, and please note that once I defended the point here that an expert on minimal synth does not even have to own a single mp3.

But whatever you say, for some people it is a difference if they listen to a record or an mp3, they do like the cover art (art wrapped up in art), and why would you want to take that away from them?

You can have virtual versions of the world’s greatest museums, but is it the same as to walk around in the real ones? Growing up in the 80s was also about the physical aspect of the way the music entered your home, and if you distract the cover art, you simply get less art.

Some of the label owners also feel that with the switch to mp3s, the world got poorer artwise and thus want to provide something that some people perceive as “better”.

So your view that mp3s are the way to go and mine can co-exist, I just get somewhat annoyed when you say there shouldn’t be any vinyl.

And if I am part of an elite just because I’m not prepared to subscribe to your point of view, then I’m very happy to be that.