Minimal Wave Records

Im very unhappy to hear that my dear friend Monica (you may know her through the room Guerre Froide on Slsk) was betrayed by the user scientronic on discogs, that we suppose he was a serious person.

First of all, she payed 300 euro with a bank transfer, to ship with a registered letter, that he never sent or at least he never provided the registered code we asked for 3 weeks.

Second, he asked 200 euro more, to ‘repare’ to the ‘damage’ sending other 3 records to her…..(the same records yes)

There are 2 options:

1)He should provide the registered letter code to proof the shipping

2) Ship the 3 records that he NEVER shipped out and provide the registered code

I had a discussion with this guy also on private mail on discogs, i can post everything if somebody needs to know more and that i am telling the truth.

As i had thousands of transactions with the mailorder, i can tell u all that i always keep the papers of the registered code, as everybody does but not him, it seems. Also you can always go to the Post Office and ask for a copy of the registered paper, they always keep a receipt, do a copy or give just the number with the date of shipping.

I know that a lot of you here knows him and i would say that apparently he’s an honest guy, but what to do in this situation?

Thanks

Im very unhappy to….

read that someone never got any deal with me can post against me.

What happened ?

I posted registered a package for his friend Monica.
Without communication i was sure package arrived.
As i am not professional seller i don’t keep the receipt for eternity :cry:
and now i read that package never arrived…..  :(

I tryed to repare the situation
I tryed to manage this with french post office but of course not possible

25 years of collecting to read that someone i don’t know wrote that here.
I collect before internet exists and i got maybe 3 issues with postoffice.
When it happened i never claim or insult the sender.

I can not do anything more to defend me but i am now very :twisted:

The only thing u can do is to provide the code, sorry..without it, is clear that there’s something not working

is useless that u try to protect yourself like this, if u give the code (and the records) of course it is all OK, otherwise sorry you are not serious at all

It is not important when you started to collect or if we know you in person, the point here is different: she payed 300 euro for 3 records and a registered letter, she received nothing, not even a code to track the package. Is it normal? for me no

‘As i am not professional seller i don’t keep the receipt for eternity’ - ehm, i still keep the receipts from September 08….u was not able to keep a receipt for not even 4 weeks…EHM! and what does it means also? that if u dont keep the receipts , you are professional….well…a total no-sense. You said you shipped on the 20 June 2009, than that u went on vacation (just the time that the bank transfer was arrived and confirmed and u can’t take it back…mhhh why everything is so wrong in this story?)...

‘repair the situation’....asking 200 euro more for the same records? well…i would not call it ‘repair’

You have the code or better you said that u trashed the code. Ok, perfect. Go to the Post Office and ask for a copy of it. is easy…

P.s. I invited him here and i advised that i opened this topic, as I AM a correct person.

thanks to a french friend of mine, i found out that scientronic username is no longer registered also on Ebay, with a percent of 93,5% which is really really bad

http://feedback.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=scientronic&ftab=AllFeedback

and in discogs it seems is not better the situation:

http://www.discogs.com/seller/scientronic

http://www.discogs.com/sell/seller_feedback/scientronic?show=Negative

Also the same french person confirmed me that u can go back to the post office and they’ll find the registered number again (with your name and the date of shipment), so dont say you can do nothing, cause is not true. you can provide us the registered number, with the DATE of shipping (dont expect that we receive a random code and we think it is ok), that, as you said, it is the 20th of June 2009.

I am not doing a process to the person, i want it to be clear. But there are too much ‘obscure’ points in this story and i think that they could be EASILY clear….if he never shipped out, he can still do…if instead he shipped out, he can still proof it…there are no other options left, sorry…(no ” i trashed”, no “200 euro more”, no bla bla, nothing)

I’ve had problems getting my package from franck b. As well.

Only after i threatened to name and shame him on the various forums all of a sudden the package “returned”. Still he needed my address (wasnt that already on the returned package?)

I bought from that infamous scientronic account as well. Many people left negative feedback on his last round of auctions (i’m sure franck will tell you they were impatient or another excuse)

Saying you lost the tracking code is not an argument. That’s your responsibility as a seller to provide the code to the costumer. “Loosing” it without providing proove means the fault is on the sellers side and he should give a full refund.

Peter, i hope your friend paid through paypal or credit card? Paypal provides you with a 45 days opportunity to refund, credit card co’s up to 6 months!

It’s a shame that one of the Big Collectors (TM courtesy of obscure) lowers himself to such behaviour. It throws a rather dubious shadow on the ways he managed to acquire his collection.

Let’s see if he’s man enough to take his responsibility. I really hope so for your friend peter, because i’m rather sick of the greed displayed in parts of the top collectors club (not all of course just the ones that appear to have trouble to keep up with the rest).

All i can say is based on my own experience: although i did receive the records in the end i wont take my chances with scientronic anymore.

No, with bank transfer and he said that it was the only method, by from what i know is not true, cause another guy that contacted me in private message said that he payed with paypal and he got big problems too

Well, another person just told me that a guy from Germany recently lost EUR 300 on him when buying the Q4U mlp from him that he never got…

Ok let’s believe that he lost ( eh eh yes of course) the paper with registered number, WHY he said that he was at the Post and that there’s nothing to do? of course, he can still proof the shipping.

Otherwise, he should give back the money or send the records with a registered letter…but at this point the best would be to receive back the money, as personally i dont trust him anymore.

He was also able to propose to pay 200 euro more….to have the records…that is totally crazy. Im very angry about this fact.

So, if he will keep both money and records, i will do exactly as you, going to every forum and spamming every where i can to be very very very CAREFUL or better TO NOT BUY from this person

I am really fade up too, a lot.

hi,

i’ve never dealt with scientronic personally but i have settings on my discogs to notify me whenever a record on my wishlist is available for purchase from sellers.  scientronic’s name comes up frequently for the most expensive records, so of course i looked to see what his releases / feedback were/was, and two users had left negative feedback describing a ‘heavy cardboard plate’ being shipped instead of a record. 

that was certainly enough for me to know never to trust this dude, even though it seems like he has some positive feedback. 

tschau

In 2006 I won the Les Ziglous 7” from Franck.  I paid him $110.00.

It arrived 4 months later :!:  and there was a crack across the entire record :cry:  He refused to refund any money, and blamed it on the post office, not his own packaging abilities.

After numerous attempts trying to get a refund I gave up. 

Then in the end of 2007 Franck emailed me a list of his collection, and said he had decided to sell everything.  I told him the only thing I wanted was the Inertia tape.  I offered him $350 for it.

He accepted, but insisted I send a wire transfer.  I was hesitant, because of my experience the prior year, but that tape was a serious want of mine, and I had dealt with him prior to the Les Ziglous 7” without any problems.  The wire transfer was a total pain, but I did it.  That was one of the stupidest things I ever did.  Once a wire transfer is sent you cannot get the money back.

I never received the Inertia tape, and after months of trying to get him to refund the money in cash or other records I gave up.
He will not answer your emails, he will not refund, and he will not compromise. 

Eight6, If you want your $20 back for your purported groove damaged $1 bin record that you refused to send back then here you go :wink:  You can have the $460 I loss to Franck, if you can get it from him. And if you can get it I want you to split it with Oystein so he can buy the Tranpsarent Illusion 7”, and Spartak so he can buy the La Valse 7”.

There you go, that is my gift to you guys.  I am feeling generous since I now have both the Inertia cassette, and Les Ziglous 7” which I got through trades with other collectors. Have fun trying to get it from him.

It looks like everyone is going to win in the end :wink:

obscure

I’ve bought 2 items from scientronic, and luckily both arrived in good time and in good shape. I usually don’t bid on anything that can’t be paid for with PayPal, so I’m sure that was the payment method. On one occasion, I had forgotten all about payment for an item (Hot Paradox lp I think) and after about 4 weeks received an e-mail again asking for payment. I apologised, and sent payment.

If ever there was an opportunity to NOT send a record, it was here; yet the record arrived in about 2 weeks.

As far as your offer goes obscure, I will once again re-iterate (wow, you are slow), the $40.00, (not $20.00) is of no consequence. It was your business ethics I was calling into question…funny how you can see that trait in others, but not in yourself.

Tha game is easy: he ships the low price items to have positive feebacks and he does not the high price items…

here anyway it was even easier, she bought out of discogs/ebay with a bank transfer (i guess instead that u can block it till it comes in value), directly trusting the person…anyway i give him 24hours to refund the 300 euro then i start to spam in every forum

[quote author=“peter_m”]Tha game is easy: he ships the low price items to have positive feebacks and he does not the high price items…

here anyway it was even easier, she bought out of discogs/ebay with a bank transfer (i guess instead that u can block it till it comes in value), directly trusting the person…anyway i give him 24hours to refund the 300 euro then i start to spam in every forum

Thinking back, both items were about $80.00 - $100.00 so that may be the reason why I received them.

I’ve won some years ago some items on ebay from Frank and got them always in good shape and right on time.
Some months ago, I’ve bought bunch of records/tapes for about 450 euro (via Banktransfer) out of ebay/discogs and the items arrived a little bit later in very good shape.  I don’t have any complaints about Frank, but I’ve seen the negative feedback of the last few months on discogs and that makes me hesitate to buy other stuff from him.  I regret, because I only have good experiences with him.

In fact i was really surprised to hear that this friend of mine was betrayed by him..the point is that now ‘investigating’ a bit i received some pvt messages and emails that say the same thing: dont buy from him, i lost xxx euro.

for me is more than a proof: i dont care if he’s a big collector from 30 years or whatever, we are just asking the proof of the registered letter (is it lost? ok u can still have a copy so this excuse is not good) or the money back.

IS EASY, Franck.

Eight6,

I distinctly remember offering you a $25.00 refund on a $40 record.  Then you refused and forfeited the refund based on “THE PREMISE”.  So since you knowingly forfeited the refund you can have only $15 out of the Scientronic Money Lot.  I want you to let Falck have the other $5 out of the original $20 that I offered so that he can buy another mobiles 7” with it :wink:

Please tell me that this is not a lie

“On one occasion, I had forgotten all about payment for an item (Hot Paradox lp I think) and after about 4 weeks received an e-mail again asking for payment. “

No one EVER forgets when they owe someone money.  Never.

Especially when they can see that they owe them that money every time they log onto their computer.

So did you forget that you owed him the money every day that month?

My business ethics are:

1.  Not to deal with people that are abusive.
2.  Not to deal with people that will not compromise.

You can read them carefully, and see which ones pertain to you.

I will even add a third option.

3.  All of the above

Since you might forget the first option by the time you get to the second one

If being “slow” means taking 10 days, and no money to get the Seeing Red 7”, and being fast means taking 2+ years, and $700 to get the same record then I am going to strive to be the slowest person on earth.

obscure

[quote author=“obscure”]Eight6,

I distinctly remember offering you a $25.00 refund on a $40 record.  Then you refused and forfeited the refund based on “THE PREMISE”.  So since you knowingly forfeited the refund you can have only $15 out of the Scientronic Money Lot.  I want you to let Falck have the other $5 out of the original $20 that I offered so that he can buy another mobiles 7” with it :wink:

Please tell me that this is not a lie

“On one occasion, I had forgotten all about payment for an item (Hot Paradox lp I think) and after about 4 weeks received an e-mail again asking for payment. “

No one EVER forgets when they owe someone money.  Never.

Especially when they can see that they owe them that money every time they log onto their computer.

So did you forget that you owed him the money every day that month?

My business ethics are:

1.  Not to deal with people that are abusive.
2.  Not to deal with people that will not compromise.

You can read them carefully, and see which ones pertain to you.

I will even add a third option.

3.  All of the above

Since you might forget the first option by the time you get to the second one

If being “slow” means taking 10 days, and no money to get the Seeing Red 7”, and being fast means taking 2+ years, and $700 to get the same record then I am going to strive to be the slowest person on earth.

obscure

Actually, I was out of town on holidays for the majority of the time I forgot to pay Franck…guess I should have mentioned that fact. Having a real life means I often take a break from my online activities to enjoy the wonders of the world. Try it some time, it will give you some much needed perspective.

Your idea of a $25.00 refund for a $40.00 item being a compromise is interesting…some might even describe it as shortchanging.

To recap: I buy a $40.00 item from you, discover it’s groove damaged, then you,  out of the goodness of your heart agree to take the record back (I pay for the shipping) and you’ll give me $25.00 of my $40.00 back. How could I say no to that deal?

Add to that offer the fact you implied I was lying about the damage as well.

Excellent customer relations! I’m sure all your customers will be heartened by the fact you view them as dishonest, and looking to take advantage of you if allowed to.

In the end, $40.00 doesn’t buy a half decent meal so the money is long forgotten. Your business practices are not forgotten, and I will take every opportunity to advertise those practices…I feel it’s the least I can do.

Call it my compromise.